TERRY GROSS, HOST:
That is FRESH AIR. I am Terry Gross. Immediately, we conclude our archive collection, R&B, Rockabilly and Early Rock ‘n’ Roll, with Allen Toussaint, who we’ll hear from later and Dion. In the event you’ve ever dismissed Dion as a former teen idol whose expertise or relevance did not survive the oldies period, what you hear in the present day is more likely to change your thoughts. He is an ideal singer, deeply influenced by the blues and nation music. I interviewed him in 2000. He introduced his guitar, and we’ll hear him carry out a few of his personal songs and among the blues and nation songs that influenced him.
Dion had his first hit, “I Surprise Why,” in 1958, with the doo-wop group the Belmonts, named after Belmont Avenue within the Bronx neighborhood through which they lived. Dion’s different hits included “A Teenager In Love,” “The place Or When,” “Donna The Prima Donna,” “Runaround Sue,” “The Wanderer” and, later, “Abraham, Martin and John.” His fan Bruce Springsteen gave the introduction when Dion was inducted into the Rock & Roll Corridor of Fame in 1989. Dion recorded a few Springsteen songs on his album “Deja Nu,” which was launched in 2000 and was the event for our interview. We began with a monitor from that album, Dion singing Springsteen’s “If I Ought to Fall Behind.”
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “IF I SHOULD FALL BEHIND”)
DION: (Singing) We mentioned we would stroll collectively, child, come what could, that come the twilight, ought to we lose our approach, if as we’re strolling a hand ought to slip free, I will await you, and will I fall behind, await me. We swore we would journey, darlin’, facet by facet and we would assist one another keep in stride. However every lover’s steps fall so in another way. Woman, I will await you. If I ought to fall behind, await me. Now, everybody desires of a love lasting and true.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR CONTENT)
GROSS: Dion, welcome to FRESH AIR.
DION: Good to be right here.
GROSS: What’s it been like for you discovering new materials? I believe lots of people, once they consider your songs, they consider the songs you probably did while you had been very younger that had been a few of them very explicitly teenage songs like “Teenager In Love” and even…
DION: Proper.
GROSS: …”The Wanderer.” It is a track about – it is a track of a younger man who in some methods is actual sizzling stuff. So, I imply, you are not a young person anymore, and the track that we simply heard is an actual grownup track. Are you – has it been troublesome so that you can discover songs that attain your viewers that you just like and which can be grownup songs?
DION: I do not know. Songs, to me, have at all times been form of like a diary, you realize. Say, after I did “Teenager In Love,” perhaps I used to be 16. These questions in that track, regardless that it is a quite simple track and it looks like form of claptrap or one thing, however it’s not. To the unknowing ear, it will appear, you realize, in the event you simply hearken to the floor of it, however it had a whole lot of coronary heart. It had a whole lot of soul, and it asks some related questions that you may ask in the present day, you realize, and songs like “I Surprise Why.” It was the primary hit document I had. , we had been – we did not know how you can write lyrics too good, so we invented this sort of percussive rhythmic sound. , we would make up these sounds. We would go all the way down to the Apollo Theater and listen to the horn gamers, and we would come again to the neighborhood and provides the vocal group – I would conjure – you realize, I would recruit guys and say, do that, do this, you realize. And I would attempt to get them to sound just like the horn part down on the Apollo Theater.
Like, a track like “Ruby Child.” I’d, you realize, (strumming guitar, singing ) I acquired a lady and Ruby is her title. I’ve to go (singing) Ruby, Ruby, Ruby, child. It was like (scatting). They had been like horns, you realize? And all that stuff was organized, you realize – I – the group was a poor man’s horn part on the road corners. That is what it was.
Even after I did “Runaround Sue” and they might – (strumming guitar, vocalizing). That was a horn part that I heard on the Apollo Theater. I simply introduced it again to the streets and gave it to the fellows to sing.
GROSS: Let me return to the start with you while you had been first listening to music. You wrote in your autobiography that Hank Williams actually influenced you early on. Once you had been a child rising up within the Bronx, what did you hear in Hank Williams?
DION: Properly, Hank Williams appeared, like, so whole to me, so dedicated to the lyric. He would really rip the ends of the phrases off on the, you realize – the top of the sentence. It gave the impression of he’d chew into the phrase and rip it off. , he would do like – properly, I can not sing like him, however the form of thought like – the primary track I heard him do was like, (strumming guitar, singing) and I let my dwelling down on the agricultural route, advised my pa I used to be going stepping out and get the honky-tonk blues. Yeah, the honky-tonk blues. Properly, oh, I acquired them. I acquired the honky-tonk blues.
, he’d say (singing) I ended into each place on the town.
And he’d rip the phrase proper off. Like I acquired it, and there it goes, you realize. And he was completely dedicated bodily, lyrically, musically, spiritually simply – I simply mentioned what’s this man speaking about? , simply – and, see, I had a man on the streets that basically helped me out rather a lot, too. There was a man in Bronx, New York Metropolis. His title was Willie Inexperienced, and he was the superintendent of a tenement constructing in my neighborhood.
And, you realize, principally what I ever – what I do is like Black music filtered by an Italian neighborhood comes out with an angle – yo. So Willie Inexperienced can be enjoying me all this John Lee Hooker stuff and, you realize, Sonny Boy Williamson. And he’d be enjoying like (strumming guitar, singing) taking place to Rosie’s cease at Fannie Mae’s. Inform my child what I heard her boyfriend say. Do not begin me speaking. Oh, lord. Inform every part I do know. I am going break up with signifying. Whoa, lord, Jack. Some folks have gotten to go. Jack gave his spouse $5 to go downtown get some.
, he’d do stuff like that or (strumming guitar, singing) and I wakened this morning, wanting round for my sneakers. Some telling me, youngster, acquired these strolling blues. Yeah. Awakened this morning wanting round for my sneakers, youngster. , and I am leaving this morning, youngster, now, with these strolling blues. Some folks inform me that they put on blues in mattress (ph), [inaudible]. Some folks inform me that they put on blues in mattress, youngster, no. [inaudible]. I am strolling, strolling blues [inaudible] strolling.
, he’d do stuff like that. So I would go into the studio and do the white model of that.
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: No, actually, however it appears like what I am listening to from you is that you just heard nation music by Hank Williams. You heard all these blues recordings.
DION: Proper.
GROSS: And what you discovered was this sort of Bronx model…
DION: And just a little doo-wop.
GROSS: Yeah. That – properly, that doo-wop was out for you, this actually, like, for you, native model of all of the music that you just had been loving.
DION: Proper. It form of…
GROSS: But it surely was genuine ‘trigger it was your music. You were not simply doing stuff within the method of any person else.
DION: Properly, Willie Inexperienced, once more, the man who was doing this, he advised me – he mentioned, Dion – he mentioned, write concerning the folks within the neighborhood, write concerning the issues you realize. And to me, after I appeared round my neighborhood, we had characters like Frankie Yunk-Yunk, Joe BB Eyes, Ralphie Mooch. There was a man in my neighborhood – they referred to as him Shakespeare. He used to say, like, 2B or to not 2B? Which is my condo?
(LAUGHTER)
DION: I believed I would get you at that, Terry.
GROSS: (Laughter).
DION: However we had a whole lot of characters, you realize? So – and so they appeared larger than life, like “The Wanderer” – his title was Jackie Burns (ph). He was a sailor who acquired tattoos throughout him, you realize? And each time he’d date a lady, he’d get her title tattooed on his physique. , this man was like, you realize, (singing, enjoying guitar) Flo on my left arm, Mary on my proper. Janie is the woman I will be with tonight. Little woman asks me which one I really like the most effective. I tear open my shirt. I present her Rosie on my chest. I am a wanderer. Yeah, I am the wanderer. I roam round, round, round, round, round. Lay that factor over your neck.
GROSS: (Laughter).
DION: However this man would stroll round together with his tank high on with all these names throughout. , he was like…
GROSS: What did you consider him? Did you want him or…
DION: He was a – he was form of a loner. He would really like – I did not know him that properly, however he simply appeared larger than life ‘trigger he was older than me and he was within the Navy.
GROSS: Proper.
DION: And he would come again and he’d have this sort of – you realize, and I form of featured myself, you realize, form of, like a avenue nook poet, you realize, burnt to the bone with the fireplace of this new rock ‘n’ roll music. So I used to be like, you realize, over there saying, what may this man – you realize, like, how can we put this man to music, you realize? And I do not suppose he ever knew the track was about him. He took off for – I do not even know if he is alive in the present day, however “The Wanderer” is a tragic track. It says, I roam from city to city. I am going by life with out a care. I am as glad as a clown with my two fists of iron, however I am going nowhere. It is about an actual – a man who simply is caught in a really form of shallow life-style, you realize?
GROSS: Earlier than you began listening to rhythm and blues and blues music and stuff like that, I do know while you had been 11, you used to sing in a bar in your neighborhood, and it sounded such as you had been an actual native attraction. What did you sing while you had been 11?
DION: Ah, yeah. I’d do – I knew 70 Hank Williams songs.
GROSS: (Laughter).
DION: Would you imagine that? I’d even sing his Luke the Drifter collection, you realize? (Singing, enjoying guitar) On the earth’s mighty gallery of images grasp the scenes which can be painted from life.
I used to be, like, 13 years previous.
GROSS: (Laughter).
DION: I believed I used to be a thinker. I did not even know what I used to be singing about. I sang “Honky Tonk Blues.” I sang “Jambalaya.” In the event you – an Italian from the Bronx – I had no thought what jambalaya meant, however it sounded so good and felt so good popping out of my mouth, you realize? (Singing, enjoying guitar) Goodbye, Joe. Me acquired to go. Me oh my oh.
– (singing, enjoying guitar) Jambalaya, crawfish pie and a file gumbo.
I did not know what gumbo was.
GROSS: (Laughter).
DION: I knew what rigatoni was.
GROSS: (Laughter).
DION: However gumbo, I had no thought. And, you realize, it – I acquired caught up on this music. And it – I suppose it is like anyone else while you get caught up into one thing, it simply took me away.
GROSS: Why do not we pause right here and hearken to the primary Dion and The Belmonts recording, which is “I Surprise Why” with these nice harmonies?
DION: That is a great angle track.
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: Yeah. Let’s hear it. And what 12 months is that this, Dion?
DION: That is ’57 – starting.
GROSS: And also you had been how previous?
DION: I used to be 17.
GROSS: OK, let’s hear it.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “I WONDER WHY”)
DION AND THE BELMONTS: (Singing) Do not know why I really like you want I do. Do not know why I do. Do not know why I really like you. Do not know why I care. I simply need your like to share. I’m wondering why I really like you want I do. Is it as a result of I believe you’re keen on me, too? I’m wondering why I really like you want I do, like I do. I advised my buddies that we might by no means half. They usually mentioned that you’d break my coronary heart. I’m wondering why they suppose that we are going to half, we’ll half. (Vocalizing). Once you’re with me, I am positive you are at all times true.
GROSS: We’re listening to my interview with Dion, recorded in 2000. We’ll be again with extra music and dialog after a break. That is FRESH AIR.
That is FRESH AIR. Let’s get again to the interview I recorded with Dion in 2000. He introduced his guitar and sang some songs.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR CONTENT)
GROSS: There is a track that you just wrote on the brand new CD that I actually wish to play ‘trigger I believe your singing now could be actually just like what it is at all times been. I do not suppose – I believe among the materials has modified, however I believe your singing nonetheless has every part in it that you’ve got been speaking about – all these influences, the urgency that you’ve got been speaking about. So, let me play a track from the brand new CD. However earlier than I do, I need you to introduce it for us. And that is referred to as “Each Day (That I am With You).” Inform us about penning this. What impressed it?
DION: Properly, it is a story, however I’ll inform it. The CD is named Deja Nu. And the track that you just’re about to play – actually, the entire CD, the entire – all of the songs in it are a film soundtrack for a film referred to as “The Wanderer” that Chaz Palmernteri wrote a screenplay for. And I used to be writing these songs for various scenes within the film. And the film acquired slowed down this 12 months, so I simply launched a CD. However anyway, each track on the CD is written for a sure, you realize, piece of the film. This track was written for a montage scene in the midst of it. I traveled with Buddy Holly and Ritchie Valens on that tour. We had been co-headlining a tour. And we had been on this little yellow faculty bus, not one among these luxurious line custom-made coaches in the present day. It was only a yellow faculty bus. We had been driving by the Midwest in 1959, February of 1959, and it was chilly. It was like 30 beneath zero. We had been freezing. However we actually form of bonded on this tour, Ritchie, Buddy and myself, as a result of we had the primary Fender guitars that had been issued, these new Stratocasters, and we had been in a form of a contest to see who would make them ring the longest. And two weeks into the tour, Buddy acquired form of fed up with the bus breaking down, and he recruit – he was making an attempt to recruit folks. He chartered a aircraft. And he mentioned – ‘trigger the extra folks he’d get aboard, the much less it will price. So he mentioned, you realize, it’s going to be $36, he tells me. And he hit the magic quantity for me.
I grew up with my mother and father screaming and yelling at one another for the lease in Bronx, New York Metropolis, on the time was $36. So my thoughts hadn’t stretched out to that place the place I may spend the entire month’s lease on a 45-minute aircraft flight to Fargo, North Dakota. So I mentioned no. So he offers me his guitar. He says, right here, he says, you realize, maintain my guitar. He says, you higher maintain it, you realize? So he took his laundry. That is what he wished to do. He wished to get a haircut. He wished to do his laundry. Provides me the guitar to maintain.
So now I am questioning, I’m wondering how his guitar sounds in comparison with mine. So I am going within the dressing room, and I take the guitar, I will plug it in, and I am saying – I used to be telling Chaz Palmernteri as he is penning this story round this e-book, “The Wanderer” that I wrote. And the film was referred to as “The Wanderer.” So he mentioned, you realize, we may do a Buddy Holly track right here within the film. Like, it does not matter anymore. I mentioned, let me write one thing. To undergo me sitting within the dressing room, enjoying his guitar and singing with – and whereas this scene takes place of them leaving us driving to Fargo, arriving the subsequent morning. So this track was written for that scene as a result of I believed I may seize this factor ‘trigger in my coronary heart, I’ve at all times wished to precise this relationship that – you realize, that I contemplated at instances or mirrored on at instances that I had with Buddy Holly, and it got here out on this track.
GROSS: And I simply wish to say for our listeners who do not know the top of the story that Buddy Holly took this aircraft that you just determined to not take, the aircraft crashed, killing Buddy Holly, Ritchie Valens and The Huge Bopper.
DION: Proper.
GROSS: So – and the opposite factor is so Chaz Palmernteri’s film is your biography? That is what he is making an attempt…
DION: Yeah. He wrote a screenplay round this – round…
GROSS: Round your biography – autobiography “The Wanderer.”
DION: Proper.
GROSS: Alright.
DION: So that is what the – this entire album is. It is really a soundtrack. In reality, I do not suppose…
GROSS: Soundtrack of your life.
DION: I do not suppose it will have got here out pretty much as good if I attempted to put in writing songs and put out an album. I form of did it inadvertently. I form of backed into it…
GROSS: Proper.
DION: …? And it is fascinating the way in which it got here out, you realize?
GROSS: So, let’s hear “Each Day (That I am With You).” This track that is, I suppose, impressed by Buddy Holly and…
DION: Sure.
GROSS: …About that…
DION: Completely.
GROSS: …Chapter of your life. It is a track written and carried out by Dion from his new CD, Deja Nu.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “EVERY DAY (THAT I’M WITH YOU)”)
DION: (Singing) Daily, I stare down bother. Heaven is aware of it is what I do. Daily, I increase my fist for the wrestle. Daily that I am with you. Daily, I get up hungry. Yeah, and I attempt to get my fill. Anyway, it is nice large nation. Now I’ve acquired time to kill.
GROSS: My interview with Dion was recorded in 2000. He turned 86 in July. Final 12 months, he launched the album “Woman Mates,” that includes duets with feminine singers. This 12 months, he launched the one “New York Minute” and had a brand new e-book referred to as “The Rock And Roll Thinker,” a set of conversations with a good friend. After a break, we’ll conclude our archive collection, R&B, Rockabilly and Early Rock ‘n’ Roll with Allen Toussaint, the good New Orleans pianist, singer, songwriter and producer. And jazz historian Kevin Whitehead will bear in mind alto saxophonist Artwork Pepper, who was born 100 years in the past in the present day. I am Terry Gross, and that is FRESH AIR.
(SOUNDBITE OF DION’S “EVERY DAY (THAT I’M WITH YOU)”)
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